In this episode of Room 301, we chat with PPC specialist Sophie Logan about holding digital agencies accountable for paid ad performance, the importance of post-click optimisation, and why businesses shouldn’t rely solely on PPC for growth.
Sophie shares hard-learned lessons from her agency days, including costly mistakes, and gives her take on the evolving role of PPC professionals in an AI-driven world.
Plus, she reveals the marketing trends that frustrate her the most...
If you work in digital marketing or with a PPC agency, this episode is one you can't afford to miss!
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Some of the resources mentioned in the podcast, as well as some of our own.
Disclaimer: These resources shared are based solely on the experiences of the podcast guest. This is not a sponsored segment or an endorsement.
Room 301 is a monthly marketing podcast brought to you by The Digital Maze, a specialist full service digital marketing agency. We discuss ongoing themes, topics and news in the digital marketing industry to help marketing manager (and business leaders) stay ahead of the curve.
Rob Twells (00:04)
Hey guys, Rob here from Room 301. Today I'm joined by Sophie Logan in another podcast all about PPC. Expect to learn all about why post-click optimization is the way to go and how to manage stakeholders in an internal marketing position. Let's get into it.
Rob Twells (00:25)
Sophie, thank you for joining me. So how do you keep your digital agency accountable for PPC results when seemingly everything is looking like it's going okay?
Sophie Logan (00:36)
I think you of course have to work with your agency and trust them, but I also feel like they need to be transparent with you as well. in terms of things like clicks and impressions, we all know that they look great, but that's not bringing the money in the bank. So I think a great way to keep them accountable is to actually share the rest of the results with them. So how are the leads going? know, what is your average sale value like? Give them that type of information so they can feedback a little bit more about the context of if it's working, what are they doing?
I am B2B lead gen specialist. That's what my bread and butter is. So I could say my work looks really great because I got loads of conversions, but actually those conversions don't become sales or they become sales and it's a low value. But really the agency can say, here, I've done the right job. I've got your conversions. You've got you what I need. So I think it's given them a little bit more information about what they've given you back so that they can work out if it's actually been of any value. But that transparency, I think is really important.
I've heard of a lot of agencies, I know it's hot topic of like owning the account and the actual business not having access to it as well. I think that is where my, my spidey senses would start tingling a little bit. think that is not necessarily a bad thing because it might be that they just don't want people to be tinkering around with things and changing it. But I think if a business doesn't even have access to just view their own account, that's where I'm starting to worry as well.
You can hold them accountable by asking them things, but also by seeing, looking at the change history. That's a good one. There's been times when I've looked in accounts change history and there's been no work done for the past three to four months. So that type of accountability, you should be able to get it without having to ask. But I think actually having a little bit of visibility there is really important as well.
Rob Twells (02:23)
I totally agree. And do you think it's up to, so let's just say I'm a marketing manager or director leading a team or I outsource an agency, do you think it's my responsibility to ensure that we're reporting back to the agency and we're tracking a lead to sale conversion and the attribution of where that lead came from, et cetera, because then that can tie into the data that maybe the PPC agency holds. you think that's, because I see a lot of companies fall down when they do that, you you'll say to a customer,
giving you ten leads, how many converted and it's kind of question marks that they don't really know. I think tying up those loose ends is really important. Would you agree?
Sophie Logan (03:00)
Yeah, I think that's where I've had a lot of difficulties with clients in the past is that I say, okay, well, I've got you 25 leads. How have they gone? And they're like, well, we don't know. Leads have been good. And I'm like, I can't work with leads have been good. I kind of need to know how they're progressing. Are they becoming customers? What are the values? So I do think it's a responsibility of the actual business to feed that information back as well.
And if you don't have that information, you know, if your CRM isn't set up very well, or you actually just don't know, also be honest with the PPC agency about that. And they can more than likely help to work on a way to fix that, to help you to be able to improve, you know, the post lead, like tracking and help you with it. But it's being open and honest, but yeah, it's a two way street. You can't just hire an agency and expect them to make everything work. You need to give them the ingredients and the insights and the context to be able to them to be able to do a good job.
Rob Twells (03:54)
No, 100%. And I think, yes, a sort sophisticated CRM implementation is the gold standard. That's what you want. if a customer was honest or somebody leading a marketing team just didn't have the budget for that, for instance, I'm sure the agency, I know we would, even if it's just a simple spreadsheet.
that we exchange etc. It just gives a lot more clarity to how the campaign is really performing in the real world and what's actually commercially working. yeah, I that's a really good insight. Something I'm going to ask you as well, I just said a minute ago, Sophie, this conversation might go a few different ways before we jump into the sort of three key questions. But what's your thoughts on, this is just something that I've been thinking about recently, what's your thoughts on post
click optimisation. I'm reading a lot about, especially in lead gen which I know you're in, it's all well and good getting the form fill out or the email address or the phone number. What's your thoughts on that post click, maybe nurturing the sequence in the sales funnel side of things? I start to see that being quite synonymous with PPC nowadays. Have you got any thoughts around that?
Sophie Logan (04:58)
Yeah, that's something that I talk about all the time. Like I think people are getting annoyed at me. They're Sophie, stop talking about the post-click. But to me, it's so important because let's be honest, a lot of our job is getting easier now for PPC. know, things are automated. You know, we don't even need to manually , CPC and check, you know, it feeds every day. actually our time is being freed up. And I feel like for me in particular, I want to be able to make every click count.
So I wanna make sure that I'm sending people to the best landing page. They've got a form that is easy to submit. I wanna get involved with the sales cycle, understanding that, seeing if there's anything I can do to influence them post-click. I feel like it is more of our responsibility now. We can't just say, I got you the click, it's fine, whatever happens, whatever happens. It is our job to keep nurturing that lead.
giving them a good landing page experience, giving them a decent form to fill out, which sounds so simple, but there's so many, especially for lead gen landing pages, their forms are ridiculous. They're asking you for every little bit of information, really personal data, questions you might not have the answer to, and that's just to submit the form. So yeah, I feel like it's a big thing for PPC specialists, especially lead gen, to actually be focusing on that as well. Can't just get clicks anymore, guys. We need sales, we need money.
Rob Twells (06:18)
Yeah, and I agree. obviously me, you know, my job is to lead this agency and try and understand where potentially the industry is going, which is difficult. You you're making, you're sort of looking at a crystal ball at that point, but I completely agree with what you're saying in terms of, I wouldn't, I don't know if I'd say the job is getting easier, but actually.
it feels like this skill set of somebody within PPC might need to be broader. So they might need to have a bit of an eye on the CRO, the UX, they might need to have an eye on how to use something like Klaviyo or whatever the post-click sequencing software they decide to use might be. And I think if your head's not in that space, you may be commoditized in the not too distant future. And I think that's the risk that agencies have at the moment. So I think…
agents need to lean into that post click optimization. And for me, it does live within PPC. think it starts there because it's this whole idea of paying for a lead and trying to make the most of that, doesn't it? There's an argument it could live in SEO and other different areas, but for me, it seems to be much more synonymous with PPC. So, yeah, I'm glad to know, glad to hear that you sort of share that view being in the game yourself as well. Are you doing anything like that in your day to day? You've sort of experimented with that.
Sophie Logan (07:31)
Yeah, as soon as I got to Beauhurst, like my first thing that I wanted to do was to get PPC landing pages and optimize them because they have pages, they were sending people to like the website, which is our website is great. It's just overwhelming. There's a lot of information there. So one of my first things I did was make PPC specific landing pages. They were only used for me. They look a little bit different to the main website. You know, we kind of test new features on it as well as like a little bit of a testing ground.
But yeah, that was like one of the first things that I wanted to do. And it's something that I continue to do like every quarter is either refresh them or build new ones and just thinking what's next, keep going. So yeah, PPC specialist, but like now it's like landing page and post click specialist as well.
Rob Twells (08:16)
No, that's awesome. Okay, fab. Well, look, we'll jump into the three questions that we typically ask our guests. So the first one is, now I everyone that I speak to on this podcast is busy day to day, whether it's sort of deep in campaign optimisation or if you've got a team, managing a team, maybe talking with stakeholders and setting expectations there. And there's lots of different ways that…
the people I speak to tend to stay on top of their workload. It might be a tool, it might be a way of thinking, it might just be a framework they use. So for the question to you is what's in your toolbox? How do you stay on top of your day to day?
Sophie Logan (08:52)
I'll be honest, I'm really old fashioned. Like I'm really struggling to like, yeah, it's all here. I've got the highlighters, post-it notes. I am quite old school in that sense. But I use calendar. Like I actually just use my Gmail calendar. I have a like shadow calendar, which is like Sophie's task list. And I like to plan out my days, what needs to be done, when it needs doing.
Rob Twells (08:57)
You a pen and paper kind of person.
meeting.
Sophie Logan (09:20)
really boring, but that's the way that my brain works to see the days, to see the times, to see where my lunch break is. And so I can factor things in that way. The one thing I realised when I'd been doing this for like six months at Boehurst was that I was actually doing it in my main calendar. So it looked like I was busy all the time. Everyone's like, you're in so many meetings. I was like, yeah, I am. Well, you're always busy in Slack. And I was like, I didn't. And it was because I was actually using my main calendar.
Slack was picking up as me being in meetings all day, but they weren't meetings. They were just me trying to prioritize my tasks.
Rob Twells (09:58)
I do exactly the same thing, obviously time blocking. I honestly don't know how people cope without it. If I just had a master list of tasks over there with no time limit assigned to it, a deadline, how does that fit into my weekly schedule? And I've been the same issue as well. I've made the mistake of putting it in my main calendar. Someone's like, I've got an MOT on Tuesday, have you?
I see your car's in for a service next Thursday because I mix my personal life and my work life into that. It might be picking my lad up from school or whatever it might be. But I honestly don't know. I've done that for years as well. I've tried different ways and I've always come back to this idea of time blocking because I simply need to know where it fits. And if someone asks me, can you do this? Can you do that? And this is where I see people fall down all the time. People say yes.
Sophie Logan (10:24)
Yeah.
Rob Twells (10:45)
the that don't time block say yeah I can do that but actually they've not considered where that fits whereas I know full well well I haven't got a gap in my calendar for a week for two weeks maybe and that needs not that needs more than one gap you might need two hours on a Tuesday two hours on a Monday two hours on a Wednesday to get it done so yeah I think it's invaluable
I'm not saying it can't work, but I struggle to see how it works, how management of tasks and projects work without it, to be fair. So, it's interesting. Anything else you use daily or to help you get through your workload?
Sophie Logan (11:13)
Yeah.
I've been trying to get into using like Chat GPT which sounds so like, like I'm a hundred year old woman, but my brain doesn't work like that. People go, I've got a task list. why don't you put it into that and let it prioritize you. Like at the moment, my mind still hasn't kind of caught up to think like that. I would never think I'm going to put it into, you know, this system so it can prioritize my day. My brain will say, pick up a piece of pen and paper and work it out myself. So I'm trying to use them a little bit more to like, like
task prioritization or for example, if I wrote a business proposal and I was a little bit stuck on like, you know, what needs to go into it. So I told it what I needed to do and I just said, do me an outline, gave me an outline and I worked from that. So I am trying to use it to kind of like cut down a little bit of manual tasks, but I'll be very honest, my brain never thinks to go there first. Someone has to remind me, why don't you use this first? Or why don't you try and use your Chat GPT? It just doesn't click yet you know
Rob Twells (12:18)
No, I get that. And do you see AI being a big part of PPC moving forward? Do you see it being part of your workflow moving forward?
Sophie Logan (12:27)
I see a lot of like attempts to try and bring it into the platforms a lot more. I think it made a massively difference for me personally being in house now, I have more time. I have more time to like manage my account. It's very simple, very straightforward. I think maybe where it would definitely come in a lot handier is for agencies who are managing multiple clients and then their multiple accounts and multiple complaints when they've got like a huge amount to deal with. I think that's where it's really beneficial.
But for me, again, slow adapter, slow to change. I'll put my hands up. At the moment, I don't use it. I don't think it's going to be a huge part of my job just at this point.
Rob Twells (13:07)
No, I agree. agree. think it will be particularly for agencies. I think they'll be the first adopters so to speak because actually speed, ultimately for most agencies are faster you go the more profitable you are. That's the big impact on margin doesn't it is time ultimately. So I do think agencies will be the first adopter and we're experimenting here at Digital Maze as much as we can effectively. Okay, fab that well look.
I'm a big believer in failing. I've failed, well, I've more times than I've had to think about, but obviously it's led to where we are now. you know, Sophie, you've been in house, you've worked in agencies, I'm sure you've seen and done it all at some point, but on that journey, I imagine you've made a lot of mistakes. So is there anything that sticks out to you, any mistakes that you've made, any failures that you've had? Bonus points if it's funny, by the way.
Sophie Logan (13:57)
I mean, I think things are funny like a few years down the line when you can laugh about it, but like at the point it feels like the worst thing in the world. I think when I was agency side in the first agency I was in, I had a lot of clients. It was probably a little bit too overwhelming for like a 20, gosh, 25, 26 year old, you know, it was a lot going on. And I had an account, it was performing really well for a software company.
I did my usual optimizations, adding negatives, doing this, and then the performance just tanked, like almost came to like a dead standstill. At the time I wanted to fix it myself. I didn't want to ask for help. I didn't want to have to show that I don't know what's going on. You know, I'm really good at my job. So I tried, I spent ages trying to fix the problem myself, but I just couldn't find it. Eventually I had to tell the client, your performance is dipped. I don't know why. And again, they're obviously not very happy about that.
Luckily, my manager was really open and was like, let me have a look, you know, let me, let me try. He's okay. It's not failure. It's just sharing. He had a look. He couldn't find out what happened. I was about to just think that I've just ruined this account, ruined this business. You know, it's all my fault. And then I went into the negative keyword list again and found that I put software as a negative keyword for the software company. And I don't even know how it happened. It was so.
So small, such a small thing that even everyone who was checking the account couldn't find it because it was so obvious, so silly. And Google Ads wasn't flagging it as a negative keyword conflict. Maybe it would have picked it up in a few days or a few weeks, but it was something as simple as that. I had just panicked, kept it to myself for a little bit too long rather than just putting my hands up and asking for help quite quickly. And I feel like probably a lot of people, especially when you're agency side at the start, you are scared to say you've
you've done something wrong.
Rob Twells (15:54)
I was going to say, is that their learning here? Is it to put your hands up sooner rather than later? I think even for, you know, I think some people in this business might look at me because I'm effectively leading the business as somebody that doesn't need help or can't ask for help. But I think I asked probably for help more than anyone here, to be honest, because I'm not the expert. You we employ the experts here.
really here just to steer the ship and set a vision, set a mission. But in terms of the day to day, where's SEO going, where's PPC going, are we doing the right things in web development? I'm not the man for that. So I have to rely and ask and get support from my colleagues on that. that's something that I learned like you, Sophie, the first pre, I'm a embarrassed to say, probably 10 years of my career. We've been doing this 15 years now. So the first 10 years probably held back a little bit by
the limits of what I could do because I thought asking for help was a sign of weakness and that because I started the business, I'm leading the business, I should know but it's not like that is it? And actually I've pretty gone faster in the last five years than the previous ten because I've worked with such good people who are willing to ask for help and more importantly I'm willing to ask for help at the first hurdle I face. So is that a learning that you've taken from that in terms of putting your hand up sooner rather than later?
Sophie Logan (17:10)
Yeah, feel like, especially I think it's the ego when you're a little bit younger is that, know, I don't need help. I'm really good. I know exactly what I'm doing. I'm the best at my job. And it's like, no, you're not like it's fine. Like you say, everybody asks for help. Everybody needs help. And actually I felt like opening up and being honest, it helped me have a better relationship with the team. We started to check each other's accounts a little bit more regularly, you know, just a second pair of eyes like.
Sometimes the problem can be right in front of you and all it takes is someone else to come in for two minutes and go, oh yeah, there it is. Yeah, it's that swallowing your pride a little bit and just pointing your hands up and saying, I need little bit of help, please help me.
Rob Twells (17:50)
Any other failures?
Sophie Logan (17:52)
I've done it again, it's the younger self. I remember putting an extra zero into the budgets for like a Google Ads campaign. So I guess I can't remember exactly what it was, but if it was 10 pounds, it was it went to 100 pounds, which is a lot of money, obviously, but the way that Google can like overbid by at least overspend by about twice a day. rather than 10 pounds a day, it was spending 200 pounds a day.
Rob Twells (18:01)
dear.
Sophie Logan (18:21)
I checked the account on the Friday, it was absolutely fine. I came on the Monday and we'd already spent the budget for the whole of the month. Like it happened that quick. And it was that simple mistake of adding the zero and then the way that the system is allowed to spend more money than you actually put down. It was like a double whammy of just hitting me. So again, it was coming to the client and saying, hands up, I messed up. This is what I've done wrong. This is what I'm gonna do to fix it. But in the meantime, we have spent the budget in.
the weekend I'm really sorry I can't you know is the damage is done sometimes but that time I did put my hands up a lot quicker but yeah just another silly mistake just one little zero
Rob Twells (19:01)
it though I think you know when again probably something that happens more when you're younger is you feel like a mistake is the end of the world but actually there's two ways you can handle a mistake one is keep it covered up bury your in the sand try and fix it but ultimately you get found out person finding out very angry very upset very annoyed or soon as you realize it you hold your hands up you say look this is what's happened
I've either got a solution or I'm working on a solution at that point, your line manager or whoever cares about that problem the most can offer support or they can just wait for your solution. That's just the best way to handle it. The times that I get most upset in my day-to-day working is when I uncover an issue that the person responsible for it knew about already but didn't say anything, didn't come forward. That's the biggest issue in my mind. So I'm very much about…
finding things early, being solution orientated and not just waiting for a solution to be given to you either. And it sounds like in that situation you kind of you ticked all those boxes, is, which is lucky.
Sophie Logan (20:08)
Yeah, it was very frustrating, but again, was another, a mistake that you learn from as cheesy as that is, you know, now whenever I put the numbers in, I'm like double checking it. And like now, like, you know, add a script on there to tell you if you're overspending and stuff like that. But at the time it was, it was, know, PPC was a lot more basic. Kinda didn't really think about those types of things. yeah, tough, expensive learning lesson, but one which, you know, years later I still keep in mind.
Rob Twells (20:35)
Well there you go, that's the most important thing isn't it that you keep in mind now. Okay, on to the main event. So what are you putting in room 301? What grinds your gears about marketing? Again, so if you've kind of been in-house and have the benefit of working in agency as well, so you've kind of seen it from both sides. So yeah, what's the most annoying thing in your opinion about marketing currently?
Sophie Logan (20:58)
And one of the most annoying things and you your head is all the time is that people just think that having a PPC campaign is going to save your world. It's going to save your business. Spend a hundred pound a day on a campaign. One, we're going to get leads or sales and it's going to save everything. You could have the most perfect PPC campaign in the world. You know, the best PPC specialist could create it. It's, know, it couldn't get any better. If people are getting to your website and your website isn't great or most importantly, your product or service is a bit naff.
It's not going to make a difference. When I've been agency side, I've seen it too often when businesses are really down at the bottom. They think, let's get some PPC in there. It's going to boost us back up again. sometimes their fall in has gone too far or they're not doing enough on the side to improve their product or service to actually make that PPC worth it. that's a real bug bear. That will always be a bug bear. PPC will not save the day ever.
Rob Twells (21:55)
And what would you say, I guess a client, but I guess in your position, more of a stakeholder, what would you say to a stakeholder if they did think that or they were trying to push you toward possibly unrealistic expectations? How do you sort of realign expectation and not set forecasts or predictions too aggressively to keep things in place?
Sophie Logan (22:19)
Yeah, I always like that saying of like under promise, over deliver. So, you know, even when I am pretty, you know, making forecasts and stuff, I do tuck it down a little bit, you know, just to give that wiggle room and also that lower that expectations. But I look mainly at like the historical past of the account. The past is a good indication of the future, especially with your PPC. Yes, PPC is getting more expensive, but
If you used to get a 2 % conversion rate, it's very unrealistic that in the next six months, you're going to bump that up to 10 or 12. So that's the type of thing that I share with the stakeholders of just kind of grounding them in reality of, yes, of course, I'd like a 50 % click-through rate, but industry benchmark is about 3.5. We've only ever achieved a 7, for example. So let's say 7.5 or an 8. Just kind of like, yes, improvements are always great, but just something more realistic and
People don't understand PBC that much. Some stakeholders or businesses, they think the sky's the limit, but when you work in it, you realise that it's not. There are limitations. There is a ceiling that you can hit.
Rob Twells (23:23)
No, 100%. I've fallen into that trap before where you kind of, I think the general feeling towards PPC is if you can get a formula working where you put five pound in and you get 30 pound out, what if I put a thousand pound in, surely I'm going to get, it doesn't work like that because actually the campaign tends to get more inefficient as it scales effectively. And again, I've fallen into that trap before as I've gotten less and less close to the day-to-day workings of a PPC campaign. So I guess,
Sophie Logan (23:38)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Rob Twells (23:53)
It's just how you speak to stakeholders who just see it from the black and white commercial view of what goes in, what comes out. What would you say to a company or stakeholder or whoever that is just using PPC to generate sales and leads? Do you think that's too much overreliance on one channel?
Sophie Logan (24:11)
Yeah, don't put all your eggs in one basket. you know, Google ads hasn't really gone down for a while. I mean, there's been times when I've not been able to access it for like an hour or two, you know, compared to like Instagram downages and stuff like that, you know, Google ads and Microsoft, you know, are relatively, you know, stable. you know, that doesn't mean that your account won't get suspended or that there might be a billing issue and then your campaigns off completely. You've got nothing.
And if you're not doing your organic, your SEO, your content, your PR, everything else, you're stuck with a platform which might not even be running for who knows how long. Also, obviously, of course, everything influences. know, every little help, every touch point helps. But I have seen it where people are like, my Google Ads account has been suspended for whatever reason. I've got no leads. I've got no sales now. And unfortunately, it's that.
Well, that's unfortunate for you, but you shouldn't have relied on it, you know, as your sole marketing option in the first place. Who knows with all these kind of like law cases, know, lawsuits and stuff going around, like who knows where these platforms are going to go. And if they're the only way that you're making leads or making sales, then you could be in trouble.
Rob Twells (25:27)
I agree, there's obviously whether something gets suspended or taken down but you know I'm a big believer in having three or four even more channels that drive you opportunities as a business. I've seen this thing you know first hand running this business that sometimes you get a load of inquiries from organic but then you have three months where an algorithm
comes out and all your traffic tanks and you have to be a bit more reliant on your PPC spend so you sort of turn that dial up and etc. Or the opposite way around, some reason your PPC campaign starts underperforming or a competitor starts going hell for leather on the sorts of terms that you're bidding on and all of a sudden you're more reliant on organic or word of mouth and the networking and stuff. So I think it's really important that people diversify the channels that they get there.
their leads from. I see a lot of small businesses can't afford to do that so they just have one but that's just the way the cookie crumbles there isn't it. So anything else you want to swing in in room 301?
Sophie Logan (26:25)
this is a more recent romp, like rage baiting, like the amount of posts on like LinkedIn and threads and blue sky where I know that they're rage baiting, they just want engagement, they're saying something stupidly controversial that they don't believe and they just want people to engage. But I'm getting to that point when I can't stop myself from reading the comments or, you know, liking and it's, I'm finding I'm seeing a lot more now across LinkedIn, for example.
There was a post the other day about a man commenting on women's breasts and it got loads of engagement and everyone's like commenting and I'm sat there and I'm thinking, this is what he wants. Stop responding, stop sharing it, stop reposting it, just stop. You're giving him exactly what he wants. So I'm seeing a lot more now and it does drive me mad.
Rob Twells (27:17)
think that will be present up until the algorithm stops rewarding it. Because at the minute it's rewarding to be polarizing or controversial, you want to call it. And yeah, you're right, I spend a lot of time on LinkedIn. It's kind of a big part of how we profile ourselves as a brand and ourselves as an individual. I look at…
I try and put posts out for myself that I think are useful for our target audience and sometimes it's a personal post, it's not quite as useful but maybe it's a bit more endearing maybe but I can't bring myself to do rage baiting, I can't bring myself to be totally polarising about something because I think a lot of it's made up as well like in real life are these people really that controversial? Probably not. Do they really care about the subject they're putting out? Probably not. Are they just trying to get eyeballs? Probably.
Sophie Logan (28:00)
Yeah.
It is so hard though, I get it, like, especially the one, the LinkedIn one the other day, like, I did want to comment, you know, you see that type of thing, you want to, you want to fight against it, you want to say a different opinion, but that was a clear example of someone, I hope, I hope, maybe it's not, was just doing exactly what he knew needed to happen to get him shared everywhere. I even saw the Metro picked the story up and was talking about it, you know, it's gone off LinkedIn now, he's being covered everywhere else.
I feel like that was done on purpose to annoy and anger people and it worked and he'll probably get business. think I'm sure he was like maybe a copywriter or content writer or something. I'm sure he get loads of business now because of that, but I think we need to just ignore it, report it or do whatever we can and like not give them what they want, which is that engagement that they get in.
Rob Twells (28:54)
Yeah, unfortunately it's probably here to stay until LinkedIn and all the other channels decide that that's not the way to get engagement. So, but now I totally agree. They will both be firmly locked away in room 301. Well look, Sophie, thank you for joining me. I wanted to ask, so first of all, tell me a more about yourself. And second of all, how you sort of got into marketing and PPC in the first place.
Sophie Logan (29:21)
Yeah. So I, I'm a PPC lead at a company called Beauhurst I'm in-house after being agency side for a fair bit. And we are a private database company, which provides really detailed insights and, you know, figures and crazy insane data to like investors and organizations to make better business decisions.
Some of that data goes straight over my head, but I know it's really important for a lot of people. And it's, you know, it's a great company to work for in terms of having data. Like I've got too much data. I don't know what to do with it. It's great. but I did a BSC in management and marketing, and I did an MA in advertising, marketing and the media many years ago. So as soon as I came out of university, I was like, I want to work in marketing. And then I realized that marketing was huge, you know,
11 years ago when I graduated, I didn't even know what PPC was. All I thought about was like newsletters and events. I didn't know about this side of marketing. So I tried a little bit of everything, email marketing. I'm not very good at that. Events, I'm okay at that. Started working on what was back then, Google AdWords for the company I was working for. I just somehow loved it, which is the most unsexy part of like marketing PPC is.
got stuck into it and then kept progressing year after year into PPC.
Rob Twells (30:49)
And then if anybody wants to know more about you or Beauhurst's work, where would they find that?
Sophie Logan (30:55)
Yeah, so I used to be quite, you know, heavily on X or Twitter or everyone's credit. No, I loved it. You know, back in the day, it was great, especially for like communities for PPC, like you have PPC chat and especially during COVID. That was like a great way for me to like connect with people and stuff. So I'm not on there anymore. I'm mainly over just on LinkedIn. Sophie Logan. Again, it's hard because
Rob Twells (31:01)
Polarizing, I hope.
Sophie Logan (31:23)
That platform is changing now, you know, with the rage, you know, the things that come up on there. But I'm still persisting with that. Trying a little bit of Blue sky. I'm not really getting into it that much again. It's just that habit forming. But yeah, so it's either LinkedIn or blue sky at the moment.
Rob Twells (31:41)
Well look, thank you Sophie, I'm very grateful for you joining me, lots of good insights there and thank you everybody who's listened and we'll see you again soon.
Sophie Logan (31:50)
Thank you.
Originally the Founder of leading Digital Agency in Derby, Frogspark (with Liam Nelson) and now the leader of The Digital Maze – our WordPress/Woocommerce & Performance Marketing business founded off the back of acquisitions of Boom Online & Evolve Trader. Rob specialises in high-level strategy relating to eCommerce, SEO, PPC, CRO, digital strategy and Web Design. With over 14+ years in the Digital Agency leadership, Rob has been involved with hundreds of marketing projects and campaigns with some of the best known brands.
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